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Update: Avianca recently filed for bankruptcy. For now, it’s business as usual at Lifemiles.
As I started to write this post, I kept shaking my head. How on earth did we end up buying Lifemiles (miles)? Especially considering my last experience with this program.
But buy them we did, and here is why. My husband and I each had about 25k Lifemiles left after redemption on United flight from Sydney to San Francisco. Naturally, I wanted to use them up ASAP, but a good opportunity didn’t present itself until summer of 2019.
Like some of you, I was in the midst of planning an epic trip to Japan in 2020. My in-laws went back and forth on whether to join us. My father-in-law’s health was rapidly deteriorating. Still, he really wanted to visit Japan, and I simply had to make it happen. You know, the idea was: If we book it, he will be alive to actually go.
It didn’t really pan out that way as he passed away in January of this year. We didn’t know it at the time, but the coronavirus would make it impossible for the rest of us to go as well. But let me rewind.
Anyway, since I had some Lifemiles sitting around collecting dust, it made the most sense to try to use them up. And that’s exactly what we did, after I’ve transferred 20k Membership Rewards points and my sister-in-law bought the rest of required Avianca miles at 1.5 cents apiece.
I knew about all the financial problems Avianca was facing at the time, so I can’t say I was going into it blind. I’ve warned my SIL that if our plans change, she will get a refund in miles, not cash. Still, it seemed like the prudent course of action, all things considered.
Ten months later…
I’ve mentioned before that I was able to cancel my FIL’s ticket, and Avianca agent was gracious enough to re-deposit miles without penalty. Of course, after coronavirus swept through the globe, it became clear that 2020 Japan trip wasn’t going to materialize. So, I figured we might as well wait until United cancels my in-laws’ flight to Osaka, so we could get the miles back into respective accounts.
I would check their reservations every few days and at last, SFO-Osaka flight dropped off from the itinerary. Not surprisingly, Avianca never sent me an email to notify me of this change. But that’s par for the course.
Anyway, now I just needed to get in touch with Lifemiles call center. I’ve said before that you need a glass of wine before conversing with these guys. But it was 10 AM, and that’s a wee bit early for this mama.
As was the case in the past, I chose “English” option, only to be connected to Spanish speaking rep, who proceeded to chastise me for my grave “error”. Or at least I think he did. Soon enough, I would get connected to the right department, only to be hung up on. This happened several times in a row, so I could see calling would be useless.
Fine, let’s email them at support@lifemiles.com It worked for me before. Only a week went by and I got no response. Then I’ve discovered that Avianca has Live Chat (!) After being dropped a few times, I was at last chatting with a rep….who directed me to their call center.
Great. So, I sent another email and the next day I finally got a response. I was notified that my request would be forwarded to the relevant department, and they would do an investigation to determine if we indeed qualify for fee-free redeposit. Never mind the fact that the United flight was cancelled, and not by us. Were they seriously going to charge me $200 per ticket to get these miles back?
Fortunately, the answer was no, at least as far as my husband’s account is concerned. After five days of waiting, his 35k miles have re-appeared. I’m still waiting to hear about mine. So, the lesson here is to not wait until the last minute to cancel your Avianca award tickets. You need to allow at least a few weeks with these guys. And even then you might have to start from scratch a few times. To be fair, part of the reason is the Covid-19 disruption to airline industry/call centers. Still, dealing with them was no walk in the park in the best of times.
Will these miles be worth anything in a month/year?
That’s a million dollar question, and I don’t have the answer. Right now, Avianca is really struggling to preserve liquidity, and many experts estimate it won’t last even a few months unless there is a government bailout. Apparently, Colombians aren’t too thrilled by the prospect.
One Flyertalk member is so worried, he has redeemed his entire Lifemiles stash toward Amazon purchases at 0.65 cents per mile. There is also an option to burn them on hotels at a similar rate. My SIL and I aren’t tempted by either prospect, so I guess we will take our chances.
It helps that she bought travel insurance, so it might actually cover her cash portion in the event of Avianca’s bankruptcy. My transferred MR points, however, will be lost forever. It rhymes. It goes without saying that you absolutely should not purchase Lifemiles for the foreseeable future. Way too risky.
Of course, bankruptcy in and of itself doesn’t mean your Lifemiles will automatically become worthless. However, if the airline actually ceases operations, it’s a different story. I’m not an aviation expert, so I can’t comment on the likelihood of either scenario. I know United has a huge stake in Avianca, so maybe it will become its knight in shining armor. And maybe Lifemiles will become United miles. Wouldn’t that be nice?
It is very clear that in the current climate we all should expect the unexpected. Who would have predicted even six months ago that Virgin Atlantic may not survive year 2020? Certainly not me. In fact, I will make an educated guess and say that Avianca has a better chance of making it out of this mess alive. It’s a national carrier of Colombia, after all. Virgin Atlantic? It’s a national carrier of Necker island in the Caribbean.
Unfortunately, redeeming either currency on partner flights is not a hedge against bankruptcy. I’ve been doing some research on Flyertalk and Reddit forums and apparently, carriers only get reimbursed via partner mileage programs after the flights take place. United (or another Star airline) may honor Avianca-issued award tickets as a goodwill gesture, but I wouldn’t bet on it.
So, for now, we wait. I’m thinking about going to Europe with in-laws next June, and if Avianca is still in business, we will use up Lifemiles first. However, I will be burning them on my family and will redeem United miles for in-laws’ tickets. If things go south, I would rather be the one to deal with the fallout.
In the meantime, you can bet that I won’t be losing sleep over potential Avianca bankruptcy. The death of my father-in-law earlier this year has only reinforced the idea that there are real problems, and then there is everything else. Losing Lifemiles or any points for that matter, firmly falls into “everything else” category. I hope that doesn’t happen, but it’s not like I can change the outcome anyway. You win some, and you lose some in this hobby. I prefer to focus on the wins.
Readers, what are your thoughts on the future of Lifemiles program?
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Author: Leana
Leana is the founder of Miles For Family. She enjoys beach vacations and visiting her family in Europe. Originally from Belarus, Leana resides in central Florida with her husband and two children.
I redeem miles but Turkish airlines did not let me check in for the flight on line and told me to call Avianca . Looks like Avianca Lifemiles took the cash and miles from my account but they did not do their part . I am going to find out only at the airport since calling it is impossible to speak with someone . Today is Nov 16 and flight is on Nov 17 Miami to Istanbul
@Arthur Yikes! I’ve heard of people having problems with Avianca redemptions on Turkish. What a terrible program. I recommend reaching out to both Turkish and Lifemiles now because there is a good chance your reservation isn’t valid. You should have a record locator on the confirmation email. Call Turkish and ask to speak to the manger ASAP.
If you wouldn’t spend $600 to have 90k miles redeposited (or buy, as you put it), can you help me understand why you wouldn’t conversely cash out via amazon at $0.65/pt–isn’t this the same value?
@Matt That’s a good point. What I should have said is “I’m not ready to cash out YET.” I’m watching the events closely and if Avianca starts liquidation process, I’ll be redeeming the miles immediately. But we aren’t there yet. That said, I wouldn’t buy Avianca miles at any price right now. But for us, it’s a sunk cost at this point, and I’m willing to take a gamble.YMMV
I’m currently stuck with a situation right now regarding LifeMiles and what to do. I had a trip to Europe scheduled for the end of May returning in June. The flight to Europe has already been canceled and I was able to get all my United miles re-deposited with no fees.
The issue now is that the return flight in June is still showing on Lufthansa schedule and as of yet has not been canceled. I reached out to LifeMiles by E-mail, because I really do not want to deal with speaking to them. They replied back and said I could change the date and would have to use it within one year of the original booking which was July of 2019 so that does me no good, or I could cancel and re-deposit my miles for $200 a person. That would be $600 total for the 3 of us. I transferred 66K Thank You Points to top off my LifeMiles account in order to book this trip. Now I’m left deciding if paying $600 is worth it to get back my 90K LifeMiles and who knows when of if I will even be able to use them. Any suggestions?
@Rich This is a tough one. Personally, I would not pay $600 to re-deposit (effectively buy) 90k Avianca miles. It’s possible the airline will restructure successfully and Lifemiles program will live on, but it’s not the bet I would be willing to make. Of course, only you can decide what to do here.
Did you by any chance buy a separate travel insurance policy? If so, you could try making a claim for re-deposit fees. Many policies cover those, just depends on the company. If not, do you happen to still have that Citi card (Premier our Prestige) open? If so, you could explore that option and attempt making a claim. Even though Citi cards don’t offer travel insurance anymore, they did when you performed the transfer. Also, if you paid the taxes with something like CSR, that’s another option. Since EU is closed to visitors, you could make an argument that re-deposit fees are unavoidable. Unfortunately, you won’t find out if they are covered until you actually pay them. You could inquire, I suppose, but I doubt any rep would answer that question definitively. For now, I guess you can wait and see if Lufthansa cancels that flight. Let me know how it goes.
Yeah, I’m having a tough time justifying spending $600 not to mention the $371 I already spent on the taxes and fees that I probably wont get back. I also canceled the credit card I used to pay the fees because the annual fee was due and it wasn’t worth it to me to keep it
I ended up calling LifeMiles and actually spoke to a pleasant gentlemen without a long wait time. He mentioned that I might qualify for a fee waiver since my outbound flight to Europe was canceled by the airline. So, he said he submitted a waiver and I will have to wait 10-15 business days for a response and a review from the LifeMiles team.
My wife did purchase a separate travel insurance policy through Travelex. She called them and didn’t get much help they told her that our policy did not cover Covid-19 pandemic. I will have to review the policy and see if re-deposit fees are included.
I think I will explore the Citi option you mentioned as I still have the Citi Premier card used to transfer the miles. For now I will continue to monitor Lufthansa schedule in the hope they cancel this flight. Thanks for the suggestions
This sounds fishy… You spoke to a pleasant gentleman at LifeMiles?!?
@Rich Sure thing! Really hope it works out for you. It’s been a mess canceling my Japan/Hawaii trip, so I feel for your situation.
@Lifemiles-Duped LOL
UPDATE:
I’m happy to report that I received an E-mail today from LifeMiles stating that my miles have been refunded to my account. I checked my account and my 90K LM were re-deposited with no re-deposit fee! I now how over 150K LM to use.
I am truly surprised I got my miles back with no additional cost. It took a phone call and I sent 3 separate E-mails. They did state that the Star Alliance redemption fee is non refundable and the taxes refund will take 90 days to complete, but I’ll take it!
@Rich That’s great news! You may want to put in a claim for the Star Alliance fees via your travel insurance. Why not?
I just got my miles redeposited too. Hopefully we can put them to good use someday.
I had 4 business class tickets that were booked through Avianca that totaled about 300,000 points that had equally come from Citi and Amex. This trip was mid April. After many phone calls, emails, and chat those points did come back to Avianca. There were some fees, but not too much and only about 1/2 of those came back to us. Now they file for bankruptcy and I wonder what may happen. I am a good mind to book a trip somewhere in the future to get those points used. I would not be flying Avianca though.
@Byron Looks like we are all stuck in a limbo here. I will have 105k potentially worthless Lifemiles, and no plans to use them in the immediate future.
Unfortunately, booking future award flights on partners won’t really protect you, as I have mentioned in the post. If an airline is insolvent, the partner most likely will not honor the booking. They get paid after you fly. A tough situation, and I’ve resigned myself to the fact that my miles will become worthless. It doesn’t mean I won’t try to burn them, but the current situation doesn’t look good. I wouldn’t put too much trust in their reassuring emails. When a company tells me not to worry, I start to worry! 😉
I have mid/late June flights to FRA and GVA on LH and LX booked thru LifeMiles. Return out of BLQ on LH and AC. I really, really want to take these flights, if for no other reason than to not deal with LifeMiles “support”. If the flights don’t happen and somehow I’m able to get the miles and fees back, then I’ll have to deal with them once more to book/fly again. Uggggh. 550k miles in limbo.
@LifeMiles-Duped You might be fine, as I don’t think Avianca will fold in just two months. Obviously, I don’t know their inner workings, but Chapter 11 does not equal liquidation. Not yet.
On the other hand, there is a question on whether Lufthansa will honor your booking. Definitely keep an eye on your reservation in the meantime. Also, if you can purchase a travel insurance that will cover Avianca demise, I recommend doing so. Nothing worse than having to buy a revenue ticket on a spot if the airline refuses boarding.
According to article on TPG re: the Avianca bankruptcy, LifeMiles is owned by a separate corporation. I’m more worried about the countries we’ll be going thru in Europe allowing travel. Fingers tightly crossed.
It’s true that Lifemiles is a separate entity. The problem is, their ability to book Star alliance flights is tied to Avianca’s existence. I personally would not put too much trust in Lifemiles existing on its own in the event of liquidation. Keep in mind, airlines get reimbursed after the flights are taken. I don’t see partner carriers letting folks on their planes, knowing they won’t get paid afterwards.
I certainly hope I’m wrong, since we have over 100k miles to burn. Bottom line, if Avianca goes bust (for real) say goodbye to Lifemiles or burn them on Amazon/hotels immediately. And yes, ability to fly to Europe in a near future is sketchy at best. It’s just a tough time for travel enthusiasts. Good luck!
Avianca filed for Chapter 11 in Federal Court. Not sure if they will keep/resume flying. No one knows at this point. At least Avianca Lifemiles is not affected for now. Pretty sad news.I always meant to ask you – did you teach your kids to speak Russian?
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-05-10/avianca-seeks-bankruptcy-after-latin-american-skies-closed?srnd=premium
@Boris Yep, saw the news and can’t say I’m surprised. The earliest we would be flying via these miles is June of 2021. I have my doubts on whether the Lifemiles program will be around by then, but I guess all I can do now is wait and see. I’m not ready to liquidate the miles on hotels just yet.
On the plus side, I still haven’t received the refund, so we will be filing an insurance claim for cash portion. The recent bankruptcy just sealed the deal.
As to teaching the kids Russian, I started out doing it, but slacked off in the last few years. No excuse, just laziness. They are surrounded by English, so it’s a challenge. They do know some Russian words and expressions, but not enough to converse. I’m so embarrassed.
I think my only “boomerang” was SYD-YVR-PEK for the cost of Australia-North Asia with getting off @YVR, but considering overpaying taxes for YVR-PEK portion, extra one way booking to get home from YVR to JFK, having to make fake booking from PEK to somewhere to avoid obtaining PRC visa and still having to fight Air Canada reps at SYD to convince them of no need for PRC visa if under 72 hours transit (showing them that fake booking out of PEK) and finally not being able to check in any luggage due to YVR not being final destination, was it really worth it? Remembering it now – maybe it was, but at the time, having to go through those hassles, I am sure it was not. One of those programs you do not want to deal with in case of irregularities. I agree that no one knows long term prospects for that program. With AA/Citi debacle not too many options to turn to for a churner now days. But nowhere to redeem, kind of silver lining, ain’t it? Продолжай твои рассказы, I kind of like them when boardingarea remembers to display them. Good luck!
@Boris Ahh yes! I remember redeeming Lifemiles on Sydney-San Francisco route and thinking that for not much more I could tack on a leg to Asia and fly in business class. We had carry-ons, so getting off in SFO wasn’t an issue. But I was too chicken to do it, so we flew in United economy for 40k miles. Your experience sounds downright scary. I’m getting sweaty palms jus reading it. 🙂 Glad it worked out!
Nice write up Leana. There used to be some “boomerangs” and miscoded airports awhile ago, I am sure you know that. I took advantage of it once or twice on earnings from their previous credit card and transfers, but I would never buy their miles. Hoping we will be able to use our miles in the future.Удачи!
@Boris Thanks for stopping by! Lifemiles program is a weird one. I’ve heard of some crazy deals to Europe and of course, the infamous US-Guam route for 12,500 miles that died a few years ago. Never could take advantage of any of them, sadly. I like direct routings and uncomplicated itineraries. As far as I know, there isn’t currently anything amazing from Orlando, though I could be wrong. Honestly, at this point, if we can redeem these miles on anything and get 1 CPM, I’ll be thrilled. I think it’s 50/50 whether the airline will survive into 2021.
@Justin I just realized that maybe I misunderstood your original comment. I thought you referred to cash tickets. If it’s mileage awards, then it’s a different story. Still, a month and no refund in sight? That’s crazy.
Out L tickets were cancelled a month ago and still no refund. They are very slow
LM*
@Justin I would follow up via email or chat. Avianca is running out of money as we speak. If they don’t refund soon, contact your credit card and see if you can file a chargeback. Complaint to DoT is also an option, though I’m not sure if it will accomplish anything. Good luck!
After cancellation of this summer’s trip and being unable to redeem lifemiles for a different hoped for trip, I suddenly find myself really flush with lifemiles., like 300k. I am pretty pessimistic about their chances of survival. I’m hoping the good folks in Colombia want to save their airline, I guess.
Flyernick, it is definitely a tough situation. I’m not quite ready to redeem the miles at 0.65 cents apiece on Amazon or hotels, but don’t blame those who do so. I also feel bad for all the Avianca employees if the airline goes the liquidation route. I guess the only thing all of us can do is wait. Maybe Colombia government will rescue the airline after all. It is a lesson for me, for sure. I personally will never speculatively transfer flexible points to miles, and will try to pick a relatively stable program when booking flights.